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New Dust-Boot and Hold-down

Discussion in 'CNC Mills/Routers' started by Florian Bauereisen, Aug 10, 2017.

  1. Florian Bauereisen

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    Hi all,
    title says it all, i finally managed to get my initial ideas done...
    So this Version includes led lighting and easy bit change.
    Again it is intendet to be used (with this shoe) on thin bendy material..
    It works quite well with the Festo vaccum cleaner turned toabout 35% so i guess it is quite efficient.

    Pics basically show how it is done. There wonT be cad files as this is very custom made to fit my cnc.
    Feel free to use the pics to get your version done.
    vid here:


    I deliberatly used a diamond cut bit to create dust not splinters..


    greets

    Flo
     

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  2. Jonathon Duerig

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    Wow. This looks beautiful. My own current system for pressure foot and vacuum is basically chicken wire by comparison. Do you have links to design files or other details? I'd really like to see if I can replicate this elegant design on my CNC.
     
  3. Florian Bauereisen

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    Hi
    its all in the pics. This fits specifically my cnc so it wont be of help showing any cad files.
    Only thing not shown is 3 screws and little springs which i drew just as red "tubes"
    Led ring sits in a recess and is covered from dust by a sort of "Plate"!
    All milled from multiple plates of 10 mm acrylic and a nearly fitting tube. (so make it fit by milling your own tubes out of the square parts)
    You will need to draw up your version to fit your cnc.

    greets

    flo
     
    #3 Florian Bauereisen, Aug 10, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2017
  4. Jonathon Duerig

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    I'll definitely need to customize the parameters to fit my machine. I suppose the questions I have are mostly about how the various parts are attached. How is the square piece attached to the spindle/holder? How is the cylinder attached to the square piece? How is the vacuum tube attached to the cylinder? It seems like you might have glued some pieces. But I'm not sure how the cylinder stays on and yet is easily removed. Is it just a friction fit?
     
  5. phil from seattle

    phil from seattle Well-Known
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    It looks like the lower boot rides up and down with the springs pushing it flush to the workpiece. How far can it move vertically? Doesn't the lower boot catch on burrs, splinters and such? Probably not a problem with wood but what about metal? I assume the vacuum pulls the lower boot down as well - just wondering if "stiction" is a problem.
     
  6. Florian Bauereisen

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    Got it right first time!
    upper assembly is glued together ( so is detachable lower) and basically held by friction. It all hangs from cnc by 3 screws..
    If you look closely you will see a litttle black magic marker mark which will ( sometime in the longrun) be drilled and tapped so to increase the friction by a screw.
    Atm it holds just fine by friction on the spindle and horizontal tube of vac.
    I will take some more pics...

    flo
     
  7. Florian Bauereisen

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    Hi
    it moves about up to 5mm and is intended for wood and plastics. it will not catch on anything for its choosen diameter..
    No need for a lot of screws and suchlike anyway as two nails will be sufficient to keep part in place. Holddown will do the rest.
    Milling Aluminum a different shoe ( more conventional with some brittles /brush) is used...

    flo
     
  8. Jonathon Duerig

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    Inspired by your build, I created a similar dust boot and pressure foot for myself. The suction needs to be improved somewhat. I'm planning on adding a foam skirt. But for holding down and containing debris, it works perfectly so far.

    This looks very different than the makeshift system I had been using before or the much flatter design I had been working on until I saw yours. So thanks for posting and making me think in this direction.

    My dust shoe comes in four pieces. The bottom is contoured to try to remove any possibility of it catching on anything. The middle plate(s) provide something for it to press against. Which is held in place in a groove and slot of the back and front pieces. Taking just a couple of screws out, I can pull off the front then squeeze the middle to get it out from under the bit. And I can then change bits or otherwise fix things. I was worried about the long term hold of the friction fit, but I still wanted to keep it easy to take apart like yours is.
     

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  9. Jonathon Duerig

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    The pressure foot doesn't remove the need for clamping the stock. You still need to firmly attach the stock to the table when cutting. It does two things:

    First, when cutting thin stock like veneers or thin plastic, large sheets are often somewhat warped over their length. The pressure foot always keeps the area you are cutting pressed flat to the table.

    Second, and more importantly for me, it helps to hold parts in place as you cut them completely out of the stock material. This is especially true of small parts on thin material. Some techniques for doing this (like vacuum tables) only work well on large parts or with custom fixtures. Other techniques (like tabs or onion skin) might require a lot of cleanup work on each piece.

    Pressure feet have limitations of their own. They don't work well if you have large contours of partially cut out material. They don't work well on thick material. They don't work well if you end mills are large. And even in the best case, you will need to inspect the parts and sometimes file or throw away a reject where it wasn't held in place well enough.

    -Jonathon Duerig
     
  10. Florian Bauereisen

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    Hi,
    quite on the contraire :D
    It completely eliminates the need of clamping on thin sheet material. with both my dust shoes i use just two nails on upper right /lower Left corner in order to stop part form wandering off. I can cut out a whole sheet of thin ply containing ribs and small parts packed so tightly it would be completly impossible attache otherwise while milling. (say ribs spaced apart just 1,5mm) without sacrificing space for clamping in some way.
    Using vacuum has its drawbacks as well, specially if you have lots of parts on a sheet. as mentioned

    Why should they work not on thick material? No need to, but just build another for different size stock.. say 1-43mm and 5-9mm,
    Cut out size? well i do not have the problem on thin sheet but that is a thing to "juggle" while designing.. size of pressure foot vs what you intend in general... sort of..
    My version is to eleminate calmping /screwing/nailing intensly on cramped thin material.,,, and to get rid of warpage on thin stock..
    Everyone who has seen it can testify for it to work flawlessly.
    clamping and taking off accounted to 25 mins per kit on one occasion which came down to 4 mins ...

    To increase suction on your version try to turn the hold down into something like a trumpet shape, this will sort of prevent false air intake / create a better seal of sorts.
    mine works with very little power on the vac.
    nice work btw.

    greets

    flo
     
  11. Jonathon Duerig

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    Marring of the surface can happen depending on your pressure foot material and the surface. I don't notice it to be a problem with the stuff I usually cut.

    Typically any chips or sawdust remaining is simply pushed around or left in the channel being cut. The springs aren't too strong, so it isn't like a pair of vice grips is pushing into the material and scraping it along. It works by minimizing friction between the foot and surface while using the downward force to increase the friction between the stock material and the spoilboard. So even with some force pushing down, if sawdust is sandwiched between the foot and the stock, the foot is going to slide over it rather than dragging it along.

    I'd test this on a small piece before trying it on something that is extremely prone to scratching. For example, when I cut acryllic, I leave the protective coating on to prevent the possibility of scratching the acrylic itself. I've never seen a case where the surface is marred, though.
     

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